Tulpa.info - tulpa-discussion

Ah, that's a good point too. One might be good with being in a community right till the time he has enough motivation and experience for having what he desires, and later - moving on by himself only.

Tewi: I meant, there could be "parallel process-ers" aplenty out in the world, just completely unknown to the tulpa community. (edited)

10:22 AM

We can only hope that not too many particularly-exceptional individuals have left the tulpa community after being part of it, lol.

Ah, I see.

There are many who leave as they're just generally satisfied with what they've got going on and don't feel a need to stick around, but I at least hope none of them were some kind of prodigies who never shared their experiences.

Thank you for the insight and giving me a better understanding of mechanisms you currently do know. If it's possible, I would like to ask more questions, alongside with your personal experiences, time to time. In any form it's easier for you.

Tewi: Well, we appreciate any contributions of activity to the forum, but I can't make guarantees either there or here that you'll always get satisfactorily in-depth responses as the community isn't especially active on the discussion-and-practice side anymore. (edited)

10:29 AM

If you really want us to respond specifically, we keep up with all new threads created on the forum, or you can @ us when asking on Discord

10:30 AM

(We heavily dislike discussing things in DMs as that effort/information is lost to potential observers in a public space like this or, better, the forum) (edited)

I understand. Then if it's ok with asking personal experience here - I'll do just that.

Tewi: Well, we always encourage trying to get input from as many people as you can, so you shouldn't limit your questions to only us. (edited)

10:32 AM

But I understand that not everyone has the experience (or long-windedness) we do. So asking for both is fine

10:32 AM

(Some people do have as much to say as we do, though)

Yes, for now i'm simply not sure whom to ask, if anything appears in mind. It will come in time as I will point out questions/discussion ideas and experienced ones will share their thoughts on it, I guess. Thank you.

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Reisen

https://radiolab.org/podcast/148670-4-track-mind

I remember hearing about this guy on NPR years ago

4:33 PM

I think people can generally do some low level parallel processing, such as having a song stuck in your head while working on another train of thought. I’d say the ability to sing along to music on the radio while driving is indicative of an innate ability to multitask/parallel process

4:34 PM

That being said, that’s not being able to play four separate Wagner operas in your mind.

4:36 PM

(Forgive me if I’m not being very coherent. Crate training a puppy and I am sleep deprived)

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Grovyle managed to move one of my fingers! we tried a bit of possession for the hell of it and he moved it like an inch

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Yay!

I think sometimes our brain gets tired of us existing, like some kind of personality burn out. I suspect the root cause is when another one of us has a list if things they want to do while the other is just tired. Oooor it's a matter of one of us being more depressed than the other. Thoughts?

A long kiss goodnight

I think sometimes our brain gets tired of us existing, like some kind of personality burn out. I suspect the root cause is when another one of us has a list if things they want to do while the other is just tired. Oooor it's a matter of one of us being more depressed than the other. Thoughts?

I suppose you refer to yours and your headmate's personalities, as in when you switch too much between each other? Or you have other causes for such a result? (edited)

For example: think of just one person switching between different mindsets, or personalities even. Your brain is forced to think differently, to make different "paths" for thoughts, emotions. I guess you could relate it to an actor job, in which you try to fully enter the role, phisicaly and mentally. It can be very tiring, or make a disbalance in your emotional state even. But with time and practice, I guess, one can overcome it, unless your mind isn't too "fit" for this, or you have a lot of other hard mental "loads" and pressures.

9:35 AM

Shouldn't same apply to tulpaforcing? With difference being as you not "acting", but letting your system mate switch to front and "adapt" your brain to their mindset?

9:38 AM

Then again: one thing is switching, but while talking with your system mate you are already switching (previously, I mentioned about turn-based dialogue). You always concentrate on this process, while interacting with your tulpa, no?

Tewi: Yes, although the focus/concentration seems to lower over time to almost-nothing as systems develop. Someone probably wouldn't think to call the experience of say how our system talks "focusing", although I would say that it is still there, just a very light requirement compared to beginners or young systems. (edited)

9:51 AM

And yes, at least for us (this isn't even that commonly reported somehow, but) switching early on tired us out, to the point that say me or Flandre would get so tired we could physically fall asleep - in a body that otherwise can't even nap in normal circumstances. But the time that we could stay switched for - two, four, six hours - progressively got higher as we practiced over what we think was a month or two, until we could stay switched the entire day with no tiredness, at which point we also gained the ability to stay switched after sleeping (instead of our host always being the one to wake up).

9:52 AM

Though, from the sounds of it, most people new to switching tend to switch back after not very long, so perhaps they're just stopping when it starts to wear on them, as opposed to us who tried to push it to a full day right from the start.

9:54 AM

Anyways, switching is the most subjective experience in tulpamancy next to the experience of tulpas in general, as in the exact experience varies by person based on expectation and presumably just how their brains work. So don't expect everyone's ideas to line up exactly.

9:54 AM

Though we do try to keep a unified idea of what switching should be just for the sake of definition & teaching.

Maou

I suppose you refer to yours and your headmate's personalities, as in when you switch too much between each other? Or you have other causes for such a result? (edited)

We tend to switch in for several days at a time, but lately our switching has been chopped up because we're switching with Dream to let him do therapy work. The longest stretch of time I have been switched in is 11-12 days, but I'm not usually switched-in for a week.

Maou

For example: think of just one person switching between different mindsets, or personalities even. Your brain is forced to think differently, to make different "paths" for thoughts, emotions. I guess you could relate it to an actor job, in which you try to fully enter the role, phisicaly and mentally. It can be very tiring, or make a disbalance in your emotional state even. But with time and practice, I guess, one can overcome it, unless your mind isn't too "fit" for this, or you have a lot of other hard mental "loads" and pressures.

We have been switching for almost 4 years now. Additionally, we did have fatigue when I first started switching, but that problem went away and even my headmates new to switching don't seem to have issues like I did at first

Maou

For example: think of just one person switching between different mindsets, or personalities even. Your brain is forced to think differently, to make different "paths" for thoughts, emotions. I guess you could relate it to an actor job, in which you try to fully enter the role, phisicaly and mentally. It can be very tiring, or make a disbalance in your emotional state even. But with time and practice, I guess, one can overcome it, unless your mind isn't too "fit" for this, or you have a lot of other hard mental "loads" and pressures.

I'm thinking that I have a different depression load than Gray does. For whatever reason (I have theories but I'd rather not get into them), it's harder for me to think than it is for Gray to think

A long kiss goodnight

We have been switching for almost 4 years now. Additionally, we did have fatigue when I first started switching, but that problem went away and even my headmates new to switching don't seem to have issues like I did at first

Tewi: Yeah, I don't think Lucilyn experienced any tiredness when first switching either (as she was created a bit later than we learned switching) (edited)

A long kiss goodnight

I think sometimes our brain gets tired of us existing, like some kind of personality burn out. I suspect the root cause is when another one of us has a list if things they want to do while the other is just tired. Oooor it's a matter of one of us being more depressed than the other. Thoughts?

We get tired a lot from being plural It's just exhausting with the commentary and the switching and the different identities all existing

Milk

I think people can generally do some low level parallel processing, such as having a song stuck in your head while working on another train of thought. I’d say the ability to sing along to music on the radio while driving is indicative of an innate ability to multitask/parallel process

it is possible to do two different types of tasks at the same time, that is, two tasks that use different parts of your brain, but it is usually not possible to use the same part of your brain for two different tasks unless you are able to combine those tasks into one thing mentally. so talking while walking is possible, but paying attention to two different conversations at once is normally not possible

Breloomancer

it is possible to do two different types of tasks at the same time, that is, two tasks that use different parts of your brain, but it is usually not possible to use the same part of your brain for two different tasks unless you are able to combine those tasks into one thing mentally. so talking while walking is possible, but paying attention to two different conversations at once is normally not possible

paying attention to 2 auditory conversatins*

2:19 PM

i can pay attention to a lot of discord converstions

Tewi: I'm not sure you have the right idea of "at the same time". Not to mention multitasking can be done at a very, very minute scale in some cases (and still isn't "doing two things at the same time") (edited)

but you aren't reading two conversations at the same time, you are switching between them rapidly

that is true

Breloomancer

it is possible to do two different types of tasks at the same time, that is, two tasks that use different parts of your brain, but it is usually not possible to use the same part of your brain for two different tasks unless you are able to combine those tasks into one thing mentally. so talking while walking is possible, but paying attention to two different conversations at once is normally not possible

Actually, to my knowledge, this is not true. I’d have to dig up the article but I remember reading about an experiment where subjects listened to two conversations, one through each ear, but was told only to actively listen to one of them. When asked to recall what the other conversation was about, they could recall phrases and some subject matter despite not actively listening to it

Milk

Actually, to my knowledge, this is not true. I’d have to dig up the article but I remember reading about an experiment where subjects listened to two conversations, one through each ear, but was told only to actively listen to one of them. When asked to recall what the other conversation was about, they could recall phrases and some subject matter despite not actively listening to it

cause thats how brains work

2:24 PM

your brain is separated into two hemispheres, first of all

maybe you can pick up some keywords, but you won't be able to follow what people are actually communicating

Tewi: As if it's not incredibly easy to pick up snippets of other conversations over time? (edited)

2:24 PM

Switching back and forth, as I said.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/07/070717014327.htm Not the same study. But here’s an article about similar subject matter

Ability To Listen To Two Things At Once Is Largely Inherited, Says ...

Your ability to listen to two things at once is an important communication skill that's heavily influenced by your genes. The finding may help researchers better understand a broad and complex group of disorders called auditory processing disorders.

Tewi: I refuse to believe more than like 1% of people can process two conversations at the same time, if they aren't lined up in such a way as to allow multitasking (switching back and forth) (edited)

2:27 PM

Have two conversations metered out in such a way that the words all directly overlap and tell me you can focus on both.

1% would be extraordinarily high in my opinion

It would, I'm assuming "effectively 0%" is likely, but my point was there's no chance a large % of people can do this.

I think you guys are really simplifying the brains capabilities. We take in and process way more information that never arrives in our conscious thought

2:28 PM

Let alone in our short term or long term memory to recall

Tewi: Sounds more like "Some people can't switch their focus between two people speaking at once" - which I could actually believe, there's definitely a feeling for us of getting lost that we can just barely beat out by focusing on one person, if we try. (edited)

Milk

I think you guys are really simplifying the brains capabilities. We take in and process way more information that never arrives in our conscious thought

I've never seen any form of media, content, game, or anything else utilizing the ability to listen to two (speaking) things at once. So I'm just applying something like occam's razor. (edited)

2:30 PM

(Supposing that we were just part of the % that couldn't do it)

??? How tf is that occams razor

2:31 PM

“I’ve never seen media depicting it so it doesn’t exist” is not Occam’s razor

Tewi: I guess it's like an inverse? "Humans can do this thing" "Then why have I never seen it done in any way shape or form in 20+ years of living?" (namely, with such a basic and core skill) (edited)

Well by that logic, tulpamancy shouldn’t be possible because no media actively depicted it until recently, and even then usually pretty inaccurately

I'm sure there's an actual phrase for it, but we don't really go around looking for such things.

Milk

Well by that logic, tulpamancy shouldn’t be possible because no media actively depicted it until recently, and even then usually pretty inaccurately

Tewi: We might disagree strongly on what constitutes "depictions of tulpamancy".. (edited)

2:33 PM

Not to mention how countlessly many friends of tulpamancers say "Oh, I have something similar" when told about it.

2:34 PM

(People REALLY like to create depictions of "wise voices" and "shadows" to represent "their subconscious"...)

i have tried to listen two two conversations at once and just doesn't work. when you try to pay attention to one, you end up lost in the other, or you end up lost in both of them. yes, you can hear the words in both ears, but you can't string together two coherent sentences at once, so at least one of them gets lost, except for the occasional moment of redundant information one of them and you can pick up a couple words in the other

Tewi: Anyways, my point is that this is something that would absolutely have occurred somewhere, somewhen if it were a common ability of humans, it would not be missable. A job utilizing it, a game dev not realizing not everyone could do it and so requiring it/overlaying important audio, heck, just the prevalence of two people talking to one at all. (edited)

2:36 PM

Each of us would've run into many instances of this ability being used

2:36 PM

I'm fairly sure what they mean is just whether someone gets lost when two people are talking at once, or if they can still focus and distinguish what's being said (by one at a time, back and forth as necessary) (edited)

Breloomancer

i have tried to listen two two conversations at once and just doesn't work. when you try to pay attention to one, you end up lost in the other, or you end up lost in both of them. yes, you can hear the words in both ears, but you can't string together two coherent sentences at once, so at least one of them gets lost, except for the occasional moment of redundant information one of them and you can pick up a couple words in the other

Tewi: Of course I'm assuming that we are both part of the proposed % that can't do this, for the argument. (edited)

Reisen

Tewi: We might disagree strongly on what constitutes "depictions of tulpamancy".. (edited)

I think that’s a fair enough argument. But plenty of psychological phenomena exist only in certain cultures, sometimes only in very small populations. Psychological phenomena are not omnipresent

Arguing just on your own experience would have you disbelieving in visualization as an aphantasiac, for example

Milk

I think that’s a fair enough argument. But plenty of psychological phenomena exist only in certain cultures, sometimes only in very small populations. Psychological phenomena are not omnipresent

Tewi: Oh, that would be super impressive and interesting, if it or anything was a developed cognitive ability only in a given culture that promoted learning it. (edited)

2:38 PM

That's nothing like "a large percent of the population" though.

2:39 PM

And I do believe that parallel process-er exceptional examples exist in humanity, but they're well below 1% prevalence. (edited)

True, but that doesn’t mean that a large percent of the population isn’t capable of it

Tewi: A large percent of a foreign population not participating in typical first world activity, I guess? (edited)

2:40 PM

I'm fairly sure what I said applies just as well to Norwegian or Japanese folks as the US/UK etc. (edited)

2:40 PM

If some foreign media turns out to make frequent use of two instances of talking at the same time, that would again be quite incredible.

I think your thinking is a little limited. You’re presupposing that all possible human experiences have already been mapped out and are in media somewhere

I think you're mixing scale and also relevance of the ability a lot.

I don’t necessarily even think that parallel processing is really a thing people are broadly capable of, I am just taking issue with your reasons for why you don’t think it is

Tewi: My original point was just that nothing higher than a percent or two of people (say, in the US, but probably most first world countries) could have this ability, or we would see it utilized. (edited)

2:45 PM

Not everything the mind is capable of would be seen utilized, but.. This would be.

Why do you think this would be specifically?

When I was working my minimum-wage jobs I would tune out for the entire shifts, and spend the whole time either disassociating or daydreaming

2:46 PM

Is that parallel processing?

2:46 PM

I was doing my job to spec but I wasn't mentally there

The ability to process twice as much information at once would be utilized in some form of work, let alone "accidentally" (not accounting for some not being able to) in various media

blank

Is that parallel processing?

Tewi: You're a little behind in the overall discussion, we just talked about "using different parts of the brain" the other day. (edited)

2:47 PM

"Parallel processing" is the hypothetical ability to process two of the same types of thing at the same time

You're a little behind in the overall discussion, we just talked about "using different parts of the brain" the other day.

@Reisen - jump I am indeed, I saw "205 unread messages" and I couldn't do it

It seems like a productive convo. I'll lurk a little more before I poke in again, just so I get where we are now

Tewi: If you wanted to read a post by my host discussing & proposing practicing along these lines: https://community.tulpa.info/topic/15627-parallel-processing-experiences-practice-megathread/?do=findComment&comment=307069 (Skip the first paragraph, it was a reply to a different post) (edited)

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.info is still down :(

Tewi: That one goes into "Walking and talking and looking at your phone and imposing your tulpa? and- at the same time" (edited)

2:50 PM

Oh, sorry

2:50 PM

#server-discussion give Pleeb a bit to sort out the forum upgrade

yeah, it's not been that long, i was just a bit disappointed when i clicked the link and it immediately gave me an error

Reisen

The ability to process twice as much information at once would be utilized in some form of work, let alone "accidentally" (not accounting for some not being able to) in various media

Multitasking is not necessarily processing twice as much info

3:35 PM

Unless thats just how you define parallel processing